Q&A: “That's why Hell is not unjust. That's why you are an apostate, anti-Christian Universalist.” My third response to Introibo Ad Altare Dei.

This article is in response to a comment made by Introbio, in which he thinks he answered my arguments or questions and made a proper response as to why damnation is just (according to him), and why I will refute him.

Keep in mind that this persons who refuses to answer questions, is a lawyer by degree and work who is supposed to defend people from injustices (but apparently not from the injustice of Hell!).

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You (Introbio) wrote: “For one who writes long screeds and calls names (i.e., "retard" and "stupid" you obviously don't have the mental capacity to understand what I wrote above.” (Cf. comment section of: http://introiboadaltaredei2.blogspot.com/2019/08/hell-under-fire.html)

Response: I used those words in context of this (below). If you don't see that this as stupid or retarded, then what will?:

“Did you know St. Alphonsus wrote about a vision of a 5 year old child that was burning in Hell? According to your idiotic (and unjust) position, you would find a problem with (and even say that God was unjust) if this child was being granted forgiveness and salvation – as you in fact already shamefully, idiotically and tragically expressed to me in your previously retarded comment that I responded too, and that you shamefully ignored and avoided giving a response too (i.e., Introibo wrote in to me in order to say that God would really be unjust if he forgave a damned soul that, according to him, deserves damnation and not forgiveness! Stupid, stupid, stupid...).” (Cf. https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2020/04/q-is-the-salvation-of-all-human-beings-souls-and-angels-an-illogical-position.html )

Yes, according to your stupid belief, this child does not deserve forgiveness or responsible parenting in the next life so that he can become good again and converted, but he “deserves” damnation and must always live in a Hell to be tormented forever without ever feeling love, hope, forgiveness or happiness ever again! Do you see now why I called your position retarded, and why you are stupid? That is because you have no sense of justice, and because you are only slaving after a God – and that is all. Instead of wishing and declaring that responsible parenting would be a just judgment for this child in the next life so that we can be friends and love each other instead of hating and tormenting each other, you flat out evilly and heretically declare that he must be damned and burn and be tormented for all eternity in a Hell that is unmerciful and evil.

What if this child was your own child? Surely, you would not want him to be damned, and you would wish there was hope. Think the same of others children then too, and do not evilly declare that damnation is “good” or “just”, because you would never have made such a judgment if you where God, hence, this position is evil, as you know. Because if you had the power, you would make a different judgment of bad people than eternal damnation. Hence damnation is false, and evil, otherwise, if it was true, you would judge the same and send people to Hell if you where God, but you would not. Be honest, ANSWER; you coward! (I already asked you this question, and received no response.

I also wrote this concerning the article: “In this article, I will try to make you respond [by being severe] and make you understand in a grave and serious way that your position is stupid and illogical.” (Ibid.)

You wrote: “All of your objections are answered. EVERY. SINGLE. ONE.” (Ibid.)

Response: No, they are not. I have already written two whole articles full of arguments and questions so far just for you, and your articles does not address my questions or arguments at all (otherwise, point out were you go through my writings or comments point by point and answering them as I do with you). Your Hell article may touch some of the topics I discuss, but it was not addressed to me hence it does not actually answer the points I bring up, so how can you say every objection or argument has been answered, when this is clearly not the case, and I can prove to you that you have not answered my questions even in this article, as we will see.

For example, you have not address any single argument on point of true justice in your comments or articles except the false argument “that God says so”, or “that it must be so”, or “we must believe so” but this is not justice, as I explained in the article because justice is not based upon what one man or woman or God says, but rather, it is based on what true justice really is, and God is not just with his Hell, as even you know, since you would not damn anyone if you yourself received the power by God over the damned to do what you want, for then you would forgive them... ANSWER THIS QUESTION NOW YOU COWARD SINCE IT PERTAINS TO JUSTICE AND PROVES THE POINT; THAT JUSTICE IS NOT BASED ON WHAT ONE MAN OR WOMAN SAYS, BUT AGAIN, ON WHAT TRUE JUSTICE REALLY IS, and then explain from your brainwashed Christian perspective “why this would be just” (even though it is not) to damn someone based on justice not seen from a brainwashed Christian's God's perspective WHEN THE SAME CRIME IF IT HAPPENED ON EARTH YOU WOULD HAVE CONDEMNED IN A HUMAN PERSON YOU HYPOCRITE BLIND PERSON, as my articles are out to explain and make you understand, but you just refuse to see it. But trust me, I will make a specific reply to your article also in due time, but not right now. But soon I will, and then, what will you say? That everything has been answered even though it has not been answered and even been refuted?

Besides, my intro continued like this, and what do you have to say about it you avoider of questions and arguments and despiser of justice, you fake lawyer and respecter of persons:

“Had God been a man, or rather, if God had been Hitler, would Introibo (who is a real lawyer) have condemned him and called him evil, not only in a court of law, but also outside of it? Of course he would. He would not, as a lawyer, defend someone like Hitler or justifiably defend their evil crimes against humanity even though Hitler was the ruler and wanted this punishment to happen to those who incurred his displeasure. But the problem here is that GOD ALSO WANTS THIS PUNISHMENT TO HAPPEN TO THOSE WHO HAVE INCURRED HIS DISPLEASURE JUST LIKE HITLER DID! So why is Introibo, who is supposed to be just and not judge according to persons, making a different judgment or ruling when it comes to a God that is different from the judgment he would make against Hitler when they are guilty of the same crime? I will tell you why, and that is because Introibo is a respecter of persons or God rather then a respecter of true justice and true charity which wills good; a justice which defends men and condemns God when man shall be defended and God be condemned.

“I know for a fact that Introibo condemns Hitler for the evil he did and he does not excuse him. He publicly states this as a fact on his blog. So why does he excuse God when God do even worse? If the argument is that God is God and hence “he must always be obeyed” and also, “God wills no evil whatever he commands since he is righteous and just” and so “we must always have faith and believe no matter what” – if one actually follows such evil and unreasonable logic of mere “obedience” (as most Christians do in relation to God) to whatever is commanded (like both Hitler and God demands or demanded from their people) rather than following the truth of always adhering too and following the true justice no matter what even if a so called God condemns you for it, then one is not actually truly defending people or following the true justice of defending real love and goodness (that desires good and happiness upon everyone) or being reasonable or logical at all, but one is rather defending evil and respecting persons and instead of being just, becomes unjust, unreasonable and illogical in defending evil; not only any evil, but the worst evil that has ever existed and been implemented by anyone at anytime! Thus, no greater injustice than Hell has ever existed, yet the fewest people condemn it or defend people from incurring this infinite and infallible injustice. It is really tragic, and sad.” (Cf. https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2020/04/q-is-the-salvation-of-all-human-beings-souls-and-angels-an-illogical-position.html)

Answer why you judge God different from Hitler when they are both guilty of the same crime and they both damn innocent people, for God also damns or condemns people to Concentration Camps of Hell for nothing, such as merely being ashamed to confess one single sin! And this is clearly unjust according to all just laws, as even the lawyer you are should know, if you are but honest, because this is not a crime in the world or by the world, but only declared so by “God”.

If you won't answer my argument or questions, then it is because you are dishonest and are afraid to be exposed. Otherwise, answer my arguments and questions, you coward, because I have already answered yours.

You wrote: “You used to be a rabid Feeneyite and even considered enjoyment of the marital act "mortal sin." Now you are a total apostate.” (Ibid.)

Response: What has been is different from what is now. But even so, no, I did not directly say the marital act was sinful, only that excess was sinful. But this “excess” judged by us was too much and we were wrong, and I was also brainwashed by my brother, but I have changed position now and when he moved out, I started to distance my self from his influence. That is the truth with my position, and now I embrace the teachings of Vatican II and Alphonsus on sexual activity.

You wrote: “In your article above you DENY that there is one true Church. Beliefs don't matter, nor do actions.” (Ibid.)

Response: No, I don't deny it, I only explained that Vatican II is this Church since the previous Church was blind and deceived in their view that damnation is just or that only Christians or Catholic can be saved. And God tells us to listen to the Church for a reason, and that is because God also learns from the Church. Since damnation is evil and everyone knows it is (otherwise, if you where God you would also damn souls but you would not do this, please ANSWER HONESTLY!) hence we know damnation is evil and hence, Vatican II follow the true teaching and they even teach to God, and God listen to the Church and hence, changes his positions or understands them better. Hence, Vatican II is the true Church moving towards the right direction. That is my position. So you said wrong, because I don't deny the Church, it is just you who deny that Vatican II is the Church – and that is all.

Neither did I say beliefs or actions does not matter. All I said was that even if people fail in life, forgiveness must be open to them. To argue that those who died in failure must always be damned and tormented because they made mistakes in life is evil, because people change and convert everyday but this conversion would be denied in a Hell where conversion and betterment is not possible, and where salvation and forgiveness is not granted, and that is also why Hell is the worst evil that has ever existed.

Also, even if conversion never happens, still, it is undeniably evil and unjust to torment sick and evil people or souls forever, because if we act like this towards them, then we are no better then they. And that is why evil people on earth is looked up in prison while being allowed to live in happiness in the prison with some form of freedom, and they are not denied betterment or conversion of soul and mind from evil, and if they become good people and role models, they may even be released or will be released in due time.

But still, I do not believe conversion is not possible, because how can love, goodness and truth be resisted forever when love, goodness and truth is true? Therefore, I do believe in hope, and therefore, I always believe total conversion is possible from evil for anyone whatever God in his blindness claims about it, even the devil himself, even if it takes many eternities. (God says a damned soul will never convert, be good or love, but this is false, because it is God whom they hate because he does them evil, and not that they hate everyone, because they had love in them and loved others while on earth.)

You wrote: “Why then did God become Man and die on the cross? What was He saving us from, if not Hell?”

Response: I will give you an answer from another article and person I spoke with. This is my answer:

““If there is no hell, Jesus came and died for nothing.” Answer: God only died for the Saved according to his laws anyway, so yes, in a sense he died for nothing because Christ refused to be truly universal and he lets billions be lost, because they are “unworthy” his graces. Do you know what this might mean? That the true Christ perhaps is yet to come, if this other Christ was no the true Christ. Because why would a true God be selfish, and only apply salvation to those who are worthy according to himself? Salvation must be applied according to justice, and not on any personal motives. And according to justice, everyone is worthy of salvation, because everyone can love and become good and give love [but this is denied by God to ever happen in his evil Hell].” (Cf. https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/05/q-why-damnation-and-eternal-torments-is-evil.html)

You ask what God saved us from? I answer. From his own selfishness in desiring humans to be like he desires us to be and the grave consequences if we failed, but this is not justice, but injustice.

I wrote about this before in another article like this:

“Rules more often then not is the cause and giver of sin, and not the fact that breaking a law is sinful in actuality when the breaking of it entails no evil to anyone, except for the dictatorial and hypocritical lawgiver, who seems to desire obedience above all else and not mercy and love. For example, if God gave us our will to live our life and have our free will, such as marrying a Protestant or a so-called “heretic” or a relative even if the Church condemned this, then no disobedience would have been enacted, and no “sin” been committed by be so-called guilty person. (Mixed marriages was not always approved by the Church, and marrying before in time against the will of the Church was an excommunicable “offense”, since such disobedience was deemed mortally sinful and damnable, even if you loved the spouse.) The same can be said about many other things, such as confessing our sins to a priest, which is an obligation in the Catholic Church under pain of mortal sin. But if someone were ashamed to confess their sin even though they felt sorrow, they would be damned, according to God's law, even if they were completely honest and good persons otherwise. Hence, it is God's law that creates sin, and not the persons itself, since marrying someone or being ashamed to confess, is not in itself a sin or evil (marrying is even love, as we know, so love is damnation?), but God has only decided to view it as “mortally sinful and damnable disobedience”, even though these are trifling matters in reality even according to the world's standards, since these acts are not judged sinful or as criminal on the earth. Rules, however, that is according to conscience, justice and our hearts, i.e., that is about doing good unto others and ourselves, are true laws and must be followed, but if someone failed to keep these laws, this is still no reason for eternally damning them! No, forgiveness and love must be open to everyone, even evil people, so that they too may have a chance to become good!” (Cf. https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/05/q-why-damnation-and-eternal-torments-is-evil.html)

You wrote: “Wait Jerome--YOUR "God" doesn't think Hitler is bad or unjust! He's going to Heaven the same as St Francis of Assisi!!” (Ibid.)

Response: False, I never said that, I never said Hitler was not unjust or bad, you unjust, blind dishonest person. How many times did I already mention Hitler was evil, unjust and bad in my articles and in the article you just read? Yet you lie or take me out of context or misunderstood something because either you have nothing honest to say, or you are just stupid and blind (which in fact you also are).

What I said was essentially this: If someone was evil and yet truly repented with sincerity and yet a God or even you would not forgive him, you would be evil and would be worse than even Hitler himself that chose love in the end, whereas you did not by not forgiving him, you evil man if you would not forgive him -- and for all eternity too?! Evil Hell, apostasy doctrine of true heresy from all love and justice for sure! And that is also why every reasonable person (like atheists and other people and religious of other faiths and even Christians who dislike Hell) do not like Hell or even contradicts it or condemns it!

Since you are so blind to conversion from evil and forgiveness and hope even in the afterlife because God has brainwashed you, let me remind you of what I wrote previously to other people about bad people converting and being saved so that you may not take me out of context anymore or misunderstand anything.

This is what I have written, both about the devil, and Hitler:

“Why do you think Vatican II moves away from this evil doctrine of Hell and separation if not because they have started to accept true justice and the law of conscience which desires and wishes good upon everyone, including ourselves? No one deserves damnation, but everyone deserves something better than eternal torments and unhappiness, as even you know. For example, just think for yourself how lovable it would be if the Devil himself finally converted and become lovable and good and like a little child if he was only given the hope and opportunity to do so! That would be amazing and great!! The devil becoming our friend and lover from having been our enemy. What happiness!, what love!, what hope!! -- To have hope and to be able to be forgiven and loved always and for all eternity by everyone! But with the evil doctrine of an eternal Hell and unforgiveness, this hope would never happen and hence this doctrine is the most evil doctrine and thought to have ever existed or been created by anyone at anytime, God or man.” (Cf. https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/05/q-why-damnation-and-eternal-torments-is-evil.html)

Also:

TraditionalCatholic asked: “How could Hitler be saved? Stalin?”

I responded: “You asked me how Hitler or Stalin (who is considered among the most evil people who have ever lived) could possible be saved? I answer: They can be saved and be happy and love and be loved and even be good examples for all eternity in the next life by henceforward always doing good and by having repented from their evil actions!

“And also, did you know that according to a doctrine even you accept, God waits to the last moment for a man's conversion? Hence, if they only changed their evil ways before death and accepted their wrongdoings and wanted to change their evil ways etc., God would have forgiven them and saved them, and if their sorrow was truly sincere and great, they would even have escaped purgatory. This is true Catholic doctrine which you cannot deny, yet you ask me how they could have been saved, as if you did not know this! TraditionalCatholic, stop being dishonest from henceforward, and see the arguments for what they are, i.e., that anyone is worthy of eternal forgiveness and love and happiness, for when they convert and change, it was always worth it, you see. For the same reason would you never give up on your own sick mother or father or child or sister or brother, but you would always hope, pray and work for their well being, and not give up on them. For the same reason then, never give up hope for those who died in God's displeasure, for even if this so-called God hates them and they hate God, we do not need to hate them (I certainly don't) and hence if we do, we will not be hated by them and therefore, we will more easier be accepted by them and share our love with them, which will not be rejected.

“You see, by being open to forgiveness, anyone can convert in due time, even if it takes eternity.! But this so-called God, in his evil faith on Hell and unforgiveness, denies this possibility. Hence, God has denied hope, i.e., the hope that the damned could convert (if it is now his belief that they never will). But since I believe in hope, I will always believe in hope, love and forgiveness for everyone and not deny it like a heretic as this so-called Catholic or Christian God does.

“In fact, what would be more beautiful to behold then to see someone evil like Hitler to truly repent in this life or even in the next and become good and loving and caring for others, even being a good example to others and of repentance and by doing good always henceforward and for all eternity too? If someone was evil and yet truly repented with sincerity and yet a God or even you would not forgive him, you would be evil and would be worse than even Hitler himself that chose love in the end, whereas you did not by not forgiving him, you evil man if you would not forgive him -- and for all eternity too?! Evil Hell, apostasy doctrine of true heresy from all love and justice for sure! And that is also why every reasonable person (like atheists and other people and religious of other faiths and even Christians who dislike Hell) do not like Hell or even contradicts it or condemns it!” (Cf. comment section of: https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/05/q-why-damnation-and-eternal-torments-is-evil.html)

And:

“If you could only see the damned being converted and being forgiven, and being saved from this torment and fire, you would cry of happiness and feelings of love and forgiveness and hope, and so would they. There are even children in Hell, mothers and fathers, brothers and sisters, neighbours etc. that all could live a better eternity, but is denied this by an evil God dictator.” (Cf. https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/05/q-why-damnation-and-eternal-torments-is-evil.html)

So what I said is that salvation must be open to everyone, even Hitler or the Devil or anyone else, because provided one believes in conversation to goodness and never denies it, everyone can convert in due time however evil they have been, but this is denied in Heaven by God – and this is heretical.

You wrote: “As a lawyer the PUNISHMENT MUST FIT THE CRIME.” (Ibid.)

Response: No crime deserves eternal torments. That is why I so much mentioned you being a lawyer and claiming to follow justice, because according to the laws you have learned, you certainly know eternal torment does not befit a crime that was only temporal. Even in the world, repentant criminals are released, and if people could live forever, they certainly would not have been punished forever, if they converted and became new men.

Besides, the world does not torment criminals, but tries to cure them. But in Hell, there are torments so severe so that they can only hate in return, and this is clearly unjust, since it denies love and repentance and love.

And to the argument that people receive life sentences. That is true, but life is only temporal. Had life been eternal on earth, the judgment would have been different. I mean, it is unreasonable to let someone live forever in a prison if the person he killed still lives in another life (if life is eternal and cannot die) and especially if this man also has converted and become good. Therefore, since the laws on earth and eternity are different, different laws applies, but still, the world understands this: tormenting others is evil, which is why the world itself does not do this to her criminals, but again, they seek to cure them, or at least, desire them to die a good deaths so they they may have happiness hereafter.

And this is even more true in the afterlife, because in the afterlife no death exists, and even people who where murdered on earth is alive in heaven, so why then always punish someone when they have already been punished, and especially if they have became new men that are now good? Hence let us forgive each other instead and love each other and be happy with each others goodness and conversion, and let us be like a big family again, like we are meant to be and love each other. For this is the only truth with Heaven, to forgive each other and love each other and to live in happiness and eternal love with each other for ever!

You wrote: “As I wrote above, "Hell is eternal because sin, though finite by itself, is primarily committed against an infinite God; the punishment must therefore also be infinite.” (Ibid.)

Response: Your argument is really not an argument of justice, but it only slaves after a God. That God claims to be infinite, or even if he is, is not an argument for an eternal punishment that never ends. Do you know why? That is because there is no justice behind this argument, which is why such a punishment would never hold up in a court of law.

Besides, God damns many souls for crimes that are not even sinful in the world or according to worldly laws or even according to your conscience, such as marrying against the will of the Church, or simply being ashamed to confess a sin. How does this deserve eternal punishment (or how does our conscience tell us this is wrong like with murder? It does not!) when the world itself does not even judge these acts as sinful or wrong? Hence, your arguments are no arguments according to justice, but you are merely slaving after a God and his evil laws even though he did not have to follow them or implement them just as the world does not implement them, so that we all may live in peace.

Only truly just laws are to be followed, and that is the law of doing good to others, not to steal, not to murder, not to take advantage of others, not to rape, and similar laws to this effect. Such laws are true, but even so, criminals are forgiven on earth, and must be so in the afterlife also.

You wrote: “If you destroyed someone's property valued at $100, he has a strict right in justice to be compensated the full $100. God's 's friendship is infinite in value and the mortal sinner broke that friendship against a Perfect Being. Therefore, the punishment must be equally infinite. Hell is neither more nor less than absolute, perfect justice; it couldn’t be otherwise. "He is the Rock, His works are perfect, and all His ways are just. A faithful God who does no wrong, upright and just is He." (Deuteronomy 32:4).” (Ibid.)

Response: In order to prove that you are lying, try to claim this “justice” in a court of law, and we will see if the judge lets you keep your work or not! If you are honest, you will see that the judge would revoke your license if you tried to implement these laws whom you claim are “just” in a court of law, because they certainly are not just, but to the contrary, if you follow true laws, such as not murdering or stealing, you would be praised and honored.

No one in the world is given eternal torments or punishment for having stolen 100 dollars. They are merely given a fine, or a small prison sentence, but God could actually damn someone for eternity if they died in this sin, tragically and evilly, and this is wrong, and you know it, and judges know it; you dishonest person who are merely slaving after a God whatever he teaches.

Both you and I know and everyone know that it would be better to let someone, in the afterlife, pay back in some way what he stole rather then eternally damning him. But such simple logic is not understood by you, because you are a slave of a God and not a man of justice even though you are a lawyer, and hence this is also the reason for that you are blind, for God is blinding you, when you should rather look to true justice, which the world and Vatican II represents better than God.

Besides, why don't God learn some humility? He felt offended? Well, don't we all get offended? God has no reason to damn someone forever just because he felt offended. Instead, man up God and tell this man or woman they did wrong, and then help them become better men and women again. Don't be an unjust fool and eternally damn them, because that is evil. You can give them a prison sentence, but do not eternally damn anyone. In truth, if you refuse to take your work seriously and do not forgive people their offenses, then let me do it and take your place, because I promise you to work for all eternity for bad people's conversion, even if they are evil, because I have hope that even they will and can become good again.

You wrote: “You see Hell as unjust because your conception of God and Justice/Mercy are both WRONG.” (Ibid.)

Response: No it is not wrong, and that is why the world and Vatican II and our conscience and heart, and also true justice, agrees with me and not with you. Only brainwashed Christians like yourself, says it is wrong, because according to you, a 5 year old child being angry with God and calling him bad names must burn in Hell and be damned if he died like this, and a nun who lived a good life but was ashamed to confess a sin “deserves” eternal damnation and torments, you evil person! This is not how the world or Vatican II judges it, which is why they don't even demand confession anymore under pain of sin. This is wisdom. Instead, they believe in mercy, and that even if someone failed in everything, that there is hope for him or her. This is also my faith and my belief, because it is just. But I go even further then they. But many in the Vatican II also believe as I do, i.e., that all are saved and that Hell is either empty, or does not exist.

You wrote: “Under your idea of God, DEATH is immoral. Why are we being punished by physical death for someone else's (Adam's) sin? If God brings Hitler into Heaven, why not just forgive all of us and make us immortal without death? How can God let a five year old die, Jerome/ Why not just make us happy without the pains and sufferings of death?” (Ibid.)

Response: Death is not so relevant on earth since life continues eternally in the next. Only what transpires in eternity, is really relevant, since justice cannot be had in this life to a full extent. But in an eternity and with the power of a just God that cannot be resisted, justice can be had. Hence that the next life is relevant more then this, because it is there that we will meet each other again and live in happiness and justice.

You ask why bring Hitler to Heaven? I answer: Because he can be or have already been converted. That is why. If he has not, let him remain in a prison or receive some punishment, or even be in Heaven, but not be so liked by everyone and not be welcomed everywhere until he has been converted truly, for then there is hope even for him. And when he finally converts and become just like you and me, then it was all worth it, wasn't it? Of course it was, because we are all brothers and sisters and we must not despise those who choose the wrong path in life, because we could have done it too! Hence that conversion and hope in others betterment is the real truth, and not eternal damnation which is actually evil.

You wrote: “As I wrote above, "people themselves become their own punishment. A person will go into the next life as the person they made themselves in this life. A human being's choice and fate are sealed at death. If someone goes to Judgement as an enemy of God, that individual rejects all that God is; love, goodness, etc. They have embraced hate, evil, and all that is wrong. That's who they will be for all eternity.” (Ibid.)

Response: Even it that is true (which I don't believe) still, I would gladly offer myself to work for their conversion for all eternity. IF God is to selfish to help them, let me do it, and do not torment them, but let us live in peace and let us do them good, so that they too will see the light. That is my faith, my hope, my love for them, because I desire them good, and provided someone desires them good, there is hope.

Also, this is what I wrote on this subject in other places, and this answers all of your arguments above sufficiently:

“I have not renounced the true faith but rather found it and embraced it, since the true faith, even according to God himself, is the Golden Rule and wishing (and wanting) good upon others, and forgiving others, especially our enemies! That is why I want to forgive the damned and work for their eternal salvation and happiness. I do not believe, as I explained, that the damned cannot be good or forgiven. If they hate God or can't forgive him, it is for a reason -- i.e., He rejected them and sent them to Hell. If they can't love God or God love them, then let someone else love them or give them love or be their God (such as Mary, or whomever else has won this title), and all would be well. It is absurd to think that a spirit or soul would refuse happiness and love for all eternity just because we have been taught this is the case. If this is not true with reasonable humans, why would it be true with spirits? It makes no sense. But even if this is true, my judgment would be to send them to earth again and live another life and make them receive a body. No human wants to deny love or live in torments, hence, it is easy to see why there are solutions to the damned and that they can start to love again. That is why I believe in love and forgiveness, and not in hate and God's evil damnation.” (Cf. https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/05/q-answer-as-to-why-i-condemn-hell-and-god.html)

I also wrote in another place:

“If you read my article you will have read many answers as to why there need to be no Hell, and why they could have been saved and lived in happiness and why God commits mortal sin by not having thought of something better for the damned (if Hell now is real and not only a true scare tactic). Would it be hard to let all the damned live on earth in a human body and hence make them live in human happiness instead of damnation? Of course not! Do humans want to live in torments and unhappiness? Certainly not! So the argument that they are always evil and can't be good is false, because they had goodness in them while they lived on earth. My judgment – which would be shared by all who have reason and love true justice above God's will if his will is evil – (if I had God's place) would be that they could live on earth instead (if they don't want to live in Heaven or we can't get along), but I also do believe that Heaven even is for them and that they can become good. …

“I did not mention devils or demons because it does not matter. They exist, but they have become, or will be good in my belief, since I have given them hope and forgiveness, so they are my friends. Do you think I want even the devil to be damned? No, I wish his salvation and happiness, and I will fight for that all the damned will be saved. And in my belief and in that of Origen, everyone will be saved in the end. Yes everyone, and that includes the devil. What is hard to believe with that the devil himself could make himself become like a little child and start to love if he was only forgiven and was granted happiness and love? How can demons love or have hope if they are only tormented and live without hope? Can't you see that they are forced to hate? If you don't believe me, try to torment yourself or be tormented by someone in insufferable torments, and then tell me what you think and if you are happy with this life or if you start to fell an urge to hate! If someone tormented you and you had no hope and you could not bear it, and you thought this would endure forever and there was no hope and you received no consolation from anyone, you will start to hate. Can one live in insufferable torments and not start to hate when one cannot bear it? Even I would have started to hate God and even Mary if I was always tormented in insufferable torments and I had no hope of being released. Not that I want to hate, but if one is not forgiven or granted love or happiness, it only seems natural to start to hate those who deny you this happiness. Hence Hell is evil, since it forces us to hate. Without love and hope, there is only darkness and hate.” (Cf. https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/05/q-why-damnation-and-eternal-torments-is-evil.html)

Finally, this is what I wrote specifically for you in the article I directed to you a while back (you never responded):

Introibo Ad Altare Dei asks: “In the strict sense, God does not condemn anyone to Hell. The person chooses it.”

Jerome answers: “I know this argument. I also held this before I got courage to actually blame God instead. I answer: If people truly choose damnation in front of God because their conscience forces it, this is a kind of force, since the conscience follows God's own laws, and not our own well being. I can assure you that I do not want to be damned. If you say I do desire to be damned you would be lying. Therefore, if I desire to be damned in the next life, that only happened because I would be overwhelmed by feelings alien and foreign to me that makes it unjust and impossible to resist. If I do not want to be damned as a human with a human reasoning, I certainly do not want to be damned in the next judgment when I look at everything differently. Since feelings can be deceptive and even can be abused (such as by God), I would guess the feelings in that case must be severe and excessive, and almost impossible to reject. Is that just? Of course not. But then again, nothing is just with a Hell and eternal torments, so the fact that people choose a Hell in God's judgment does not surprise me, since I can see already that there is foul play at hand – because humans with a human reasoning will not and will never want to be eternally tormented or live in a sea of fire for all eternity. That is just common sense and reason. Hence, the argument that people choose Hell by themselves fails and is unjust, since this own condemnation of conscience to an eternal Hell is forced upon the soul with feelings foreign to our current understanding. It is unjust to judge the soul or body separate from each other, or from an understanding different from common human reasoning that looks to its own well being.” (Cf. https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/07/response-as-to-why-the-doctrine-of-hell-do-not-follow-true-justice-or-logic.html)

You wrote: “That's why Hell is not unjust. That's why you are an apostate, anti-Christian Universalist.” (Ibid.)

Response: You blind fool. What you say is essentially this: “That is why damning children and unconfessed nuns IS NOT UNJUST BUT EVEN GOOD, and I see not injustice with them burning in Hell or being tormented forever without ever being released...”

Do you see now why I called your arguments and reasonings retarded? Because they are.

You say Hell is “just” only because God says so, and because you are forced to agree with this position because you are a coward too cowardly to stand up to true justice – and that is all. Be honest.

If Hell was “just”, the world and our conscience and God's Church and our heart would agree with this, but they don't.

That our heart don't agree with Hell is obvious, because if you where God or had his place, you would not damn anyone but look for solutions for all eternity that the damned may be saved and become good. So you are refuted, and your arguments are pathetic and no arguments at all, since you are merely slaving after a God whom you fear might damn you to Hell for questioning him or thinking of something better for others and yourself. But your actions are cowardism, and not justice or braveism.

Also, and I repeat myself: if Hell was just, this means you would have made the same condemnation and judgment over the damned as God did if you where God, but you would not do this. ANSWER THIS QUESTION! If you where God or received the power over the damned by God, what would you do? Would you try to convert them, or always damn them, you evil person? Hence this question refutes you, because it proves you would not damn the damned if you had the power over them, and hence, Hell is not just, for no sane person would ever to this to others, but if they did, they would be evil. Yet you excuse God, because you are blind and a respecter of persons (or a respecter of God) and not of justice. You are therefore just a blind follower of God just like the Germans (who did evil) was to Hitler.

You wrote: “The fact that YOU can't comprehend that makes you "reason-challenged," not me. I invite all my readers to read your prolix nonsense.” (Ibid.)

Response: I do comprehend and understand, which is why I always answer every single question and argument, but you have never responded to anything so far, but all you do is ignoring everything.

But we shall see what you do, since I did ask you some questions and made many arguments and quotations even in this posts, and we shall see if you actually dare to respond to them. My guess is that you perhaps won't (or?) because if you do answer, you will condemn yourself and your God in the process.

Here is the immediate previous article you also ignored:

https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2020/04/q-is-the-salvation-of-all-human-beings-souls-and-angels-an-illogical-position.html

You wrote: “You do a much better job than I could in showing why your beliefs are idiotic and contrary to Christ Who was God and clearly taught an eternal Hell.” (Ibid.)

Response: In the judgment day, we shall see who was right. But even now, you are wrong, but since you are not honest, the point is meaningless to argue.

At least we can see who answers questions and arguments, and that is me; whereas you answers nothing and only hide behinds arguments already addressed. That “God said this” “or that” is not an argument of justice, because God has no right to be unjust and command evil. Hence, when God commands Hell, he does an evil and must therefore be resisted, because there are obviously better solutions or alternatives for the damned then an eternal Hell, and this would be a temporal prison where they will learn to become good again and love. End of story.

You wrote: “Praying for your conversion,” (Ibid.)

Response: And I pray and hope that you will answer my questions (because if you do, you will see the truth) and that you will truly start to follow the true justice which you now falsely claim to follow (as a lawyer nonetheless!).

I have written three articles now in response to you, and so far, you have not addressed any of the arguments or questions but only written small comments in response but without actually answering answering anything.

Even here in this most recent discussion between us, I have asked you questions and made many arguments to prove the points of justice which you do not follow, and specifically asked you to answer them. Again, we shall see what you will do about it.

Signed,

Ville Hietanen (Jerome)

Against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com

Q&A: Is the salvation of all human beings, souls and angels an unreasonable or illogical position? My second response to Introibo Ad Altare Dei.

Introibo Ad Altare Dei: “Jerome, If there is no Hell, conscience doesn't matter. Baptism of desire is moot. Everyone is saved, so we don't need baptism by water or baptism by desire/blood. You don't even need to believe in Christ. You don't need to live a good life. The problem with those who reject Hell is that they believe themselves to be more merciful than God. It's pure emotion devoid of reason. “I wouldn't want someone to torture me [or my wife, mother, father, etc] forever, so I could do things better than God. Hell does not exist.” See my post on the subject of Hell I wrote about 2 weeks ago: http://introiboadaltaredei2.blogspot.com/2019/08/Hell-under-fire.html Everything you wrote in this post is a waste. Why go to Church at all! When St. Paul tells us to “work out thy salvation in fear and trembling” he was out of his mind! ---Introibo” (Source: Comment section of https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/08/why-i-no-longer-reject-vatican-ii-or-the-traditional-priests-or-receiving-sacraments-from-them.html)

Introduction: Keep in mind that this person, Introibo Ad Altare Dei, who wrote to me previously and falsely condemned and ridiculed my views and called them “illogical” because I say damnation is evil and wrong (his shameful comment can be found in this article's comment section https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/05/q-why-damnation-and-eternal-torments-is-evil.html) is a lawyer by decree. A true and just lawyer is of course meant to fight for justice and defend people against discriminating and wrongful behavior not only in a court of law, but also outside of it.

Therefore, Introibo knows very well all the laws that he has sworn as a lawyer to uphold in order to defend the innocent and also all the reasons and the logic and justice behind them since they defend people from evil and unjust/excessive punishments and crimes and dictatorial behavior, yet when it comes to defending others from an eternal unjust Hell in the afterlife, whether they be humans, aliens or angels (which is a just lawyers duty to do not only in this life, but also in the next) he does nothing!, even though they (the damned) would always live in eternal torments which is similar or far worse than Hitler's inhuman and unjust concentration camps on earth and that Introibo readily would have condemned and called evil, although God's Hell is infinitely worse then a concentration camp and it can never justly be compared with anything on earth, however evil it is, yet it is not evil enough to be condemned by Introibo even though he would easily have condemned Hitler for doing the same or even less? That reasoning of course is not only illogical and unreasonable, but also evil and wrong and unjust and is not how a real lawyer that is meant to protect people must act. Therefore, you should be ashamed of yourself, Introibo.

Remember, Introibo claims to be a lawyer and to protect people, and yet despite him being aware of that this injustice of an eternal Hell will occur to the damned (who are our beloved brothers and sisters) and that Hell will murder them there in torments which is worse than any concentration camp or any other torment on earth, and despite him knowing that they must ALWAYS (as in always, always, always for all eternity) stay in this place and never get out and always live there without hope and never feeling love, happiness or forgiveness again for all eternity (which is the most evil thing that has ever happened or been thought of by anyone at anytime, God or man), and in which even 5 year old children have been recorded to be damned for ALL ETERNITY and actually suffering such torments now (if there is a Hell right now, that is) – A CHILD THAT VERY WELL COULD BE YOUR OWN BELOVED AND DEAR CHILD! – Introibo, despite knowing all of this and being fully aware of this and despite claiming to be a lawyer who defends people from injustices, is still claiming TO SEE NO INJUSTICE WITH HELL!; I repeat: is still claiming TO SEE NO INJUSTICE WITH HELL!;with this so obviously, excessive and unjust crime and punishment against love, true justice and humanity; and he even hypocritically defends the culprit who actually have admitted to will this to happen to those whom he deems worthy to be damned! This culprit of course is God.

Introibo Ad Altare Dei evilly wrote: “Even if punishment were TEMPORARY [for the damned] it still would be unjust [to release them] because they get eternal happiness thereafter [and they don't deserve this, according to him]... Your position makes God unjust.” (Source, comment section of: https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/05/q-why-damnation-and-eternal-torments-is-evil.html; see my response to his evil comment here: https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/07/response-as-to-why-the-doctrine-of-hell-do-not-follow-true-justice-or-logic.html)

Had God been a man, or rather, if God had been Hitler, would Introibo (who is a real lawyer) have condemned him and called him evil, not only in a court of law, but also outside of it? Of course he would. He would not, as a lawyer, defend someone like Hitler or justifiably defend their evil crimes against humanity even though Hitler was the ruler and wanted this punishment to happen to those who incurred his displeasure. But the problem here is that GOD ALSO WANTS THIS PUNISHMENT TO HAPPEN TO THOSE WHO HAVE INCURRED HIS DISPLEASURE JUST LIKE HITLER DID! So why is Introibo, who is supposed to be just and not judge according to persons, making a different judgment or ruling when it comes to a God that is different from the judgment he would make against Hitler when they are guilty of the same crime? I will tell you why, and that is because Introibo is a respecter of persons or God rather then a respecter of true justice and true charity which wills good; a justice which defends men and condemns God when man shall be defended and God be condemned.

I know for a fact that Introibo condemns Hitler for the evil he did and he does not excuse him. He publicly states this as a fact on his blog. So why does he excuse God when God do even worse? If the argument is that God is God and hence “he must always be obeyed” and also, “God wills no evil whatever he commands since he is righteous and just” and so “we must always have faith and believe no matter what” – if one actually follows such evil and unreasonable logic of mere “obedience” (as most Christians do in relation to God) to whatever is commanded (like both Hitler and God demands or demanded from their people) rather than following the truth of always adhering too and following the true justice no matter what even if a so called God condemns you for it, then one is not actually truly defending people or following the true justice of defending real love and goodness (that desires good and happiness upon everyone) or being reasonable or logical at all, but one is rather defending evil and respecting persons and instead of being just, becomes unjust, unreasonable and illogical in defending evil; not only any evil, but the worst evil that has ever existed and been implemented by anyone at anytime! Thus, no greater injustice than Hell has ever existed, yet the fewest people condemn it or defend people from incurring this infinite and infallible injustice. It is really tragic, and sad.

So while Introibo thinks he is just and reasonable in his approach (while hypocritically accusing me for emotionality in his previous comment, and of being illogical (and he did this because I promoted, fought for and defended the good and noble position and justice that every creature, man, animal or angel, shall be saved as opposed to being damned!), but as we have seen, it is Introibo that is completely clueless, illogical and UNJUST since he is merely a respecter of persons slaving after a God who positively wills us to be damned and unforgiven if we happen to be damned.

The example of Hitler is actually a good one, for just like God, Hitler also did evil and murdered and tortured people in concentration camps. Hitler did this towards the people who had incurred his displeasure; and even though these people offended no one but Hitler and his likes, they where still accused, targeted and punished and it did not matter if this accused innocent person's beloved ones family, spouse or children desired this person's happiness and release from the concentration camp in order to see him and love him again, for they where still denied this request to their heartbreak and deep sorrow. But as all people and especially Christians should know, God also wills the punishment, damnation and torment in an eternal Hell (eternal concentration camp with unending torments!) of all those whom have incurred his displeasure, even though they might not have offended anyone else but God and only God wants this punishment to be inflicted upon them and no one else!; and here also, just like with Hitler and the concentration camps, it does not matter if the damned person's beloved ones family, spouse or children desires this damned human being's release so that they may see him again in order to receive his love! Nay, I say even more! Even if the whole world wills this (the damneds' release) and even if all the world hates God for what he has done against the damned who are our beloved children, mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers and spouses etc. (just because they did not live up to his hypocritical standards), they are still denied this request of being released from Hell by God even if the whole world request it, and hence according to God's evil will (which thankfully he will not have when true justice comes to heaven), those human beings capable of loving and receiving our love, must always live, according to God's own word, in a fire with demons torturing them in indescribable tortures likened by God with cutting your teeth with knifes and with being burnt in a sea of inextinguishable fire and sulphur in addition to being deprived of all hope, happiness, friendship and love for all eternity and they will never see their loved ones again only because “God” wills it! That is right, all this eternal evil and suffering will befall our beloved “damned” children, mothers, fathers, brothers and sisters (that God allows and wills to be damned) ONLY BECAUSE HE WILLS IT! Not because they deserve it according to us or because you or I or anyone else wills it, but once again only because God wills it. That is completely and utterly evil and unforgivable.

In truth, I have never before seen or heard about a more evil thing, thought, deed or doctrine than this heresy and apostasy of Hell and eternal damnation found in the Christian religion. The fact is that of all the evil things anyone has ever done to anyone else, God is the worst criminal in all of history, and nothing surpasses the evil which God has done and willed to be done for those whom he deems “worthy” of this; and God is even worse than Satan himself, for God could hinder Satan and save the damned if he only wanted to. But he does not! Do you know why? That is because God doesn't feel like saving them, since they “deserve” damnation, according to him! That is why! That is completely evil of course (as anyone who is honest would readily admit), and it is evil dictatorialship to the max just like with Hitler, who also was an evil dictator murdering those whom he deemed “worthy” of this; but God is infinitely worse than Hitler because Hitler DID NOT damn anyone FOR ALL ETERNITY!, but GOD ACTUALLY DOES THIS AND EVEN WILLS IT!!!

How anyone can actually defend this position of an eternal Hell or punishment, or a God who does this to billions and billions of humans, angels and souls THAT ALL CAN LOVE AND RECEIVE LOVE AND GIVE LOVE after having it so clearly explained to them (i.e., that this is wrong and that it does not have to be like this) is evil; it is inexcusable, and unreasonable and also illogical because it does evil to our beloved fellow humans – our beloved mothers and fathers, sisters and brothers, and children – and that is why I am trying to make this truth clear to everyone, but especially to the Christians, who most of them do not follow their conscience on this point.

Almost throughout all the ages have Christians shamefully (instead of standing up to a true justice which does not wish this unhappiness to befall upon anyone nor believing that there it is any justice in this) silently just “accepted” this horror and kept silent; unreasonably thinking to themselves that there is “justice behind all of this.” They are like brainwashed sheep, and they do not dare to defend the damned or think of anything better for themselves or the damned for they themselves fear damnation and being damned for having a will of themselves that is contrary to God's declared will, and even if their own thoughts are more noble and even better than God's, they still fear and believe they can't resist God or will their loved “damned” ones' salvation. Such behavior is of course not reasonable or just! It is, rather cowardice and evil, since it silently gives approval of evil by not denouncing it, and just accepting it.

But is this really how true justice works, or how a human being, and real human love and love for others etc. should be treated? Should they all just be ignored silently and cast aside like worthless trash just because “God” wants this misfortune to happen to our beloved ones? No!, that is certainly not the way of true justice and love. When we know Hell is evil and unjust since it damns our beloved human beings (and who does not know this?) then we must dare to stand up against God and his evil Hell and condemn him!; for if we do not, we become just as evil or worse and more unjust than God himself on this point because we have been better instructed and know better true justice which wills good upon others, not only due to the media, the world and the Vatican II who all teaches universal goodness and salvation, but also because of the fact that we can resist God on this point easily and hence do an act of justice and love for our fellow human brothers and sisters, but who actually does this?

If this is not our goal and approach in life (i.e., embracing true and real goodness for ourselves and others), then we condemn and reject our conscience and are deceived, because this goodness which must be followed by everyone is the law of doing good to others and ourselves and this is the law of love, kindness, forgiveness and charity for our fellow human beings, whether they be damned or not.

Do you really want to become unjust and break this truth of love and justice and conscience of doing and wishing eternal good (as opposed to eternal evil) on your brothers and sisters just because God said so?(a truth that you also know is completely true in your conscience and heart (i.e., that you don't want damnation for anyone or that anyone must suffer for eternity)). How utterly stupid is that, really? To become a criminal because someone else wants it? How stupid! Don't be a fool! If you would condemn Hitler because he was evil and because he murdered and “damned” the humans we love, then likewise must God be condemned for doing the same or worse, i.e., for his condemning and “damning” and murdering in a fire the human beings we want to love... (if he now actually damns anyone anymore, which I have been told he does not since doing otherwise would be unjust.)

But be glad, for there is hope, because the people in the Vatican II Church do not have to fear following their conscience anymore on these point of doctrines (on eternal forgiveness, love and salvation for everyone), since God's Church today more and more moves away from this evil doctrine of eternal damnation and Hell; and many in the Vatican II Catholic Church even teach that everyone is saved and that no one is damned! Also, no one is punished in God's Church today for teaching this or believing in this doctrine! Do you know why that is? That is because this doctrine is true, and because it gives us the opportunity today to easier follow our conscience. Before in time it was much harder to hold this position without being condemned or burned at the stake, because the world was much different then and much more repressing since there was no sense of unity among peoples as there is today. In other words, there was a lack of universal connection among peoples as we have it today – a connection with breeds true love and unity for our fellow human brothers and sisters, mothers and fathers, daughters and sons and the elderly and even animals and nature etc. – and the media is much to thank for this awakening of a more noble and truer sense of brotherhood and sisterhood and justice for our own and others welfare that occurred during our century.

The Church has largely changed Her position and view on Hell, salvation and forgiveness, and that for a reason; and She is about to change her views on these points even more in the future, and that again is because this belief of unity, justice, friendship and salvation that the Vatican II Church is striving towards and working for is true, and because it actually follows the law of conscience and justice, whereas anything else (i.e., positions that wills or accepts unforgiveness, unlove and/or eternal torments of our loved ones) would break and deny this law of conscience and law of love and law of justice and make us criminals.

Now, let us look more deeply at Introibo's unreasonable comment and my responses:

Q&A: Is the salvation of all human beings, souls and angels an unreasonable or illogical position? My second response to Introibo Ad Altare Dei.

Jerome responds: Introibo Ad Altare Dei, you coward! You never even responded to my previous comment and blog post in response to your first comment (see this post: https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/07/response-as-to-why-the-doctrine-of-hell-do-not-follow-true-justice-or-logic.html) even though you arrogantly called me wrong and unreasonable then too. Well, we quickly saw who was unreasonable.

In this article, I will try to make you respond and make you understand in a grave and serious way that your position is stupid and illogical.

Now, you are essentially only defending Hell because God said so, and that is all! That is like excusing Hitler and his Concentration Camps just because Hitler said it should be done in this way, or because he “said so.” Do you not see how stupid this is? You know that Hell is evil, that's a fact! And the proof of this is that you don't want this suffering of an eternal Hell to happen to anyone and if you could, you would prefer another way for the “damned” so that they could be saved and forgiven; and if you were God or had the power to do so with his permission, would you not do it and give them a better eternity, so all could become friends? If am I wrong on this that you would do this as described above, please prove me wrong and shame yourself further, but I am sure I won't be wrong, since otherwise you would be worse than even Hitler or Stalin or worse than a mass murderer and hence utterly despicable! Do you know why? That is because you would be totally and indescribably evil if you could prevent people from suffering in a Hell yet did not do it. That is an infallible fact!

If you answer these questions honestly, you will see and admit to the fact that you would not have done to the “damned” what God did, since you know this would be evil. Answer honestly now what you would have done if God gave you his place, or if you were given the power over the damned and God permitted you to think of something better. ANSWER! (I will be awaiting your honest response that will prove the point of true justice, conscience, and love, which you do not follow, but I do, which is why I defend people and justice, and you don't, for you are only slaving after a God, and that is all.)

That is why all the secular laws condemns such inhuman injustices against other living beings, and why God and God's Hell would not stand a chance in a real and just court of law. As both you and I know (since you are a lawyer and since I am honest and just on this point), had someone likened to God and his Hell been prosecuted in court for the crimes of torturing and murdering billions of humans in Concentration Camps because they were displeasing to him, then you and everyone else would infallibly have condemned him and you would not have had the slightest problem whatsoever to accuse him for the worst crimes ever imagined against humanity and you would even have had a completely clean conscience for doing so and having feelings of righteousness because of what you did in accusing this man, since your actions are true, noble, right, charitable and just; whereas if you had defended this evil man (like trying to excuse his murders by claiming they were just as you sadly and pathetically do with God) then you would be dead not only in your conscience, but also in your soul and that is why you or anyone else that is good and has a true and good conscience would never do such a thing, because you and others certainly know that it is evil to defend and excuse evil and that it goes against all justice, both divine and secular. Please answer me honestly if I am correct on these points of reasonings. The honest answer you will give will once again prove the point of conscience, and what true justice and love is all about, i.e., that evil is to be condemned and justice followed, no matter what.

Therefore, Introibo, since you are a lawyer by decree and occupation and also claim to be just according to law and have a good conscience, you certainly know the above reasoning and ruling would be the only outcome in a court of law and also the judgement made by you, you hypocrite! So why then don't you defend the damned (who all are living beings capable of loving and giving love) rather than God, when you know the punishments he evilly allows to be inflicted on them are unjust and excessive and against all laws? Please answer honestly why you defend God when you know the punishments are evil and unjust and excessive according to all secular laws, and why it would be “just” to say otherwise only because “God says so” when this is not actually a true or valid argument in determine what true justice is or an excuse for breaking one's conscience. ANSWER! And please, do not try to excuse yourself with the argument that you just must believe in this because “God says so,” because then you do not follow justice at all, but rather become a respecter of persons (i.e., of God even if he wills evil) rather than of truths (i.e., of true justice which wills good for our fellow human beings in willing their salvation and happiness even if God condemns you for it)!

Also, se my response to your previous unreasonable comment that you completely ignored here:

https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/07/response-as-to-why-the-doctrine-of-hell-do-not-follow-true-justice-or-logic.html

By all means, please make a response to my article, and do not avoid my arguments and questions like a coward again as you did before, but address them directly, point by point. For if you do, you will look like a complete and utter fool and be despicable (in the same way as a person is a fool and despicable who defends or justifies genocide (the mass murder of entire human groups and races of people) just because he was a racist or evil like Hitler or Joseph Stalin) if you still actually tried to defend Hell or the evil and despicable argument that a human being capable of loving (like your spouse or child or mother or father or priest etc.) must be damned “if God wills it” or that “this is according to justice!” as you previously sadly admitted it was because “God says so” since the damned are “unworthy of love and happiness” because they died “not perfectly pleasing to God” according to his hypocritical high standards.

Introibo Ad Altare Dei evilly wrote: “Even if punishment were TEMPORARY [for the damned] it still would be unjust [to release them] because they get eternal happiness thereafter... Your position makes God unjust.” (Source, comment section of: https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/05/q-why-damnation-and-eternal-torments-is-evil.html)

See my first response to Introibo's evil comments above here: https://against-all-heresies-and-errors.blogspot.com/2019/07/response-as-to-why-the-doctrine-of-hell-do-not-follow-true-justice-or-logic.html

Now, would you say someone was reasonable or just if they defended all the evil that Hitler or Stalin did? Certainly not. The same goes for you, Introibo. That is why you might not take up this challenge and make a public response ( with a link to my article?) and actually answering all the arguments, points and questions? But we shall see what you do. If you do address the arguments, you will have to admit and come to realize some disturbing for you but true points for me, i.e., that my position and thoughts are true since I defend goodness and human lives, and God's wrong, since he wishes, permits and allows the damnation and murder of billions of human souls forever in the worst possible torments for all eternity without hindering it in anyway, whereas I do not do this. We both know it, you know it, I know it, and everyone else knows it. That is why dishonest fools like yourself who engages in these kinds of discussion look the other way around, ignoring the relevant facts completely and refusing to answer questions – just like you did.

Introibo wrote: “Jerome, If there is no Hell, conscience doesn't matter. Baptism of desire is moot. Everyone is saved,”

Jerome responds: So what is the problem with that everyone is or shall be saved? The fact that you bring up this point as an argument – as if there is a problem with this happening to others – as if there is a problem with that our beloved Muslim brothers and sister (that all can love someone and give love and receive love) can achieve eternal salvation – that this would somehow be problematic in your view: is the most idiotic and sad thing or worldview that I have ever seen coming from someone like you who is a lawyer by decree since you are supposed to be just and protect people and do them good, and also considering that you did read my article that points out the reason and justice behind Universal Salvation and how evil it is to damn others for eternity on mere faith and not on actual deeds done, or just silently accept this position; because again you claim to be a lawyer and to be just and to fight for true justice, kindness and love not only in a court of law, but also outside of it and even on your blog!

So you are supposed to stand up to evil people and dictators like Hitler who do evil and murder people (or like God, who damns people) and not defend them! Isn't that right? Yet you don't do this, sadly, in case with the damned humans, which accounts to perhaps billions and billions of people being eternally damned if the Saints belief and that of the Bible is right, or believed and followed by God or you (they taught most of humankind are eternally lost).

Yes it is true, everything is “moot” in comparison with wishing good upon everyone – even ones enemies (see Leviticus 19:34; Galatians 5:14; Matthew 7:12, see also Luke 6:31 and Luke 10:25-28; Tobit 4:15; Sirach 31:15 etc.) – and nothing really matters in comparison with the fact that all living things that exists, or that have been created or born (whether they be angels, humans, aliens or animals) can live together in true happiness, friendship and love like a huge and great family in salvation and happiness for all eternity! Nothing is better then this, and nothing is worse then Hell.

Now, if even one soul or living creature or animal is damned in the Hell God and the Saints teaches us about, then there is a serious and unforgivable problem – and that is evil of course – since even the least living thing have feelings and can feel pain; and to allow such a miserable existence as a Hell for even one living thing is unforgivable, since it is unendurable (unbearable) to live forever in pain and without love. No one can live in such a miserable eternity and be happy, and to in fact force this eternal misery upon others just because you or someone else (like God) wants this, is the greatest crime that has ever existed or been realized by anyone, ever! But that is not all, Introibo, and it gets worse.

Both you and I know that there are not only animals burning in this Hell and nothing else, which if true would be bad enough in itself and unforgivable since they can love and have feelings too and hence must be shown love, and not hate (animals don't go to Hell), but there are in fact real living human beings and souls burning and being tormented in this Hell right now if this Hell is actually true (which I hope and believe it is not, since this is clearly unjust); but that still is not all and it gets even worse, for there are even small children burning in this Hell as well, being eternally tormented in sufferings that is perhaps far worse than even all torments on earth combined!

Did you know St. Alphonsus wrote about a vision of a 5 year old child that was burning in Hell? According to your idiotic (and unjust) position, you would find a problem with (and even say that God was unjust) if this child was being granted forgiveness and salvation – as you in fact already shamefully, idiotically and tragically expressed to me in your previously retarded comment that I responded too, and that you shamefully ignored and avoided giving a response too (i.e., Introibo wrote in to me in order to say that God would really be unjust if he forgave a damned soul that, according to him, deserves damnation and not forgiveness! Stupid, stupid, stupid...).

Or did you just miss my whole comment and then new blog post that was posted just for you when I even made sure to make a comment on your own blog in order to make sure you saw it? To my knowledge, my comment on his blog has never been accepted! Yet he claims to accept all comments and that he is not afraid of a challenge (unless the comments are derogatory or attacking others by unfair language and such), yet my comment contained nothing of the sort.

But to answer your argument more fully, no, the positions mentioned (conscience, baptism, believing in Christ or going to Church etc.) are not without purpose, since this matters to those people who believe in them, follows them or performs those rituals and goes to Church etc. But should eternal salvation, happiness and love for our fellow human beings, souls, animals and angels really be governed by these things, just as if one cannot be saved without them and hence must be damned without them? No! That is completely illogical, unreasonable and evil, and is the same kind of stupid and unjust logic and reason as arguing that black people must be segregated and denied various work just because they are black – and that was all! But sadly, this level of stupidity is in fact how both God and Christian usually argue when it comes to Hell. “God says so” (i.e., eternal Hell and damnation for those he deems worthy of this despite what we ourselves might think of it), therefore, “we must believe it and accept it, even if my own child was damned.”

Not that Christians would accept damnation of their loved ones willingly or gladly or will such a misfortune such as if their own child or spouse or brother or sister or father or mother was damned; in fact, I think more Christians would be willing to rebel against God if they knew for a fact their own child was damned; but since it does not concern them so much (since it's only the so and so called person that they don't know about so well that is or might be damned), they don't really care enough to make a big deal about it. Well, they are completely wrong, and when they die, they will see the great mistake for their true lack of charity and love for their good or bad neighbour, or even for the most evil person that they perhaps more evilly thought deserved eternal damnation like many evilly think of Hitler.

No one deserves damnation, not even people like Hitler and do you know why? That is because he and anyone else can become good again if they were only given the chance and hence they can be our friends and so instead of hating each other we would love each other and be like lovers and a family and that is of course infinitely better then choosing to always hate our enemies and unforgive them! That is my faith and belief and my goal for all eternity – that we all will get along! If this is not your faith, what do you believe in?

If you follow a dictator God and an unjust biblical Hell, then you probably believe in a Hell with torments likened to being cut asunder alive with a saw and being burned alive in a volcano like a fish in water without the possibility of ever dying or feeling love or of ever being released again for ever and for all eternity! (As if someone actually deserves such an evil eternity however evil they have been... No! Never!) What an incredible injustice against love and forgiveness this belief is! No one deserves such a fate however evil they have been (i.e., a life in a Hell without hope of ever getting released again or feeling love or happiness ever again) for that is clearly unjust.

That is an eternal truth of love no one can deny without having done an evil choice if they ever make the decision to believe this, for to actually think anyone deserves this fate – and for ALL ETERNITY TOO and being obstinate about it is evil personified! (It is evil really, even if it does not seem so to you because you are dishonest and not a just person because you have been brainwashed to believe in this, but if you just think about it and is honest then it is not hard to see why it is evil, for what you want and silently accept (without rebelling or disagreeing) as an eternal fate for your neighbour is the most evil life possible, i.e., that the most evil things for all eternity are to happen to him or her; and you have agreed with this by your silence and refusal to rebel against this injustice against an unjust God.)

Those who think this eternal damnation is just should think about if this instead occurred to them! If you were damned, would you not want to be forgiven and given an eternity of chances to make up for what you have done wrong instead? Of course you would. Then think and do the same for your neighbour! For that is the Golden Rule and Law of Love which we all must follow in order to be truly just.

As I mentioned earlier in another comment, many people who have a good conscience (but perhaps not on all points, or at least, not good enough according to God) and that live good lives, are still damned by God merely for the fact for having died in his displeasure. Yes, that's right, they died in God's displeasure only, and even though they were loved by other human beings and were pleasing to them, and they truly loved each other and wanted to be with one another, they must still be damned according to God and must remain damned and separated for all eternity even though no one else wants this to happen (according to God's evil and unjust Hell doctrine that is). Don't you see how evil this is? People want to love you and be with you but are denied this only because an offended God wants it? That is no different than from what Hitler did, since Hitler did the same evil deeds against the Jews as God does against those he evilly damns. According to Hitler, even if the Jews were good people and loved others and were beloved by everyone (except for Hitler and his likes of course), they were still in his displeasure and had to die (or with God, be damned).

God does the same with those he allows to be damned. He could forgive them or work on some plan for all eternity that all may become friends and love each other and come along in some way; heck, he could even let them live on earth for all eternity in human happiness and love instead of damning anyone, but he does not do so. Do you know why? That is, again, because HE wants it so. That is right, HE wants it so! Not because you or I or anyone else wants it (which would not make it just or lawful to do, i.e., to damn anyone even if we would want something like this to happen, of course), but again only because HE wants it does it happen (and those brainwashed by him which does not really count, since they all would change position if God changed position, or if they saw the light, or had it explained to them by someone else, like me or you)!

From this can be learned that God is an evil dictator just like Hitler, and that he must be deposed and deprived just like Hitler; and if God is evil (which it seems he is, unless this is just all a test to see who wills to be truly just even above a God himself), then I will gladly depose him myself with this justice that cannot be resisted (for not even God can resist a true justice, since God claims and professes himself to be completely just AND to always follow justice, no matter what); therefore, when we (the world) comes before God with this justice in the final judgment – when true judgment will be gone over and examined in order to see and learn what true justice is and who was right and who was wrong etc. – what will God do, do you think, against those like us who wish to do more good than God himself for the sake of love, if not fall from his place?

If God does not change his evil position and falls, when he has fallen, I would gladly take his place myself or let someone more worthy of it have it – a person that always desires and wills good for everyone and for all eternity (for everyone's children), and not only for his own (i.e., and not only for his own children or the so-called elect as God does) for the very reason that no evil dictator may ever rule, damn or make an injustice against anyone ever again.

And this justice of wishing good towards others and to have mercy, especially towards one's enemies in order to forgive and love, and also by not wanting damnation to happen to anyone nor silently just accept such an evil deed are shared by many in the world, but not by most hard core Religious or Christians, such as Traditional Catholics or Protestants; but rather by non-Christians or atheists.

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All of what I have written in this article is my current belief and faith of God, heaven and the afterlife which I also have been told is true since God either changed position on Hell or never actually did this to anyone as we were taught (i.e., that God does not actually damn anyone even though he teaches this doctrine as almost everyone believes he does, for God wanted people to follow a truer justice on this point even above his own person in order to see who would not be a respecter of persons but rather a respecter of justice and conscience and dare to stand up to him when he was not just on this point). Humans are not to follow a false justice which only respects persons and then neglect true justice. Even the world abhors behavior like this and condemns it (like the case with Hitler or Hell, which is exampled with concentration camps by me, which all secular laws rightly abhor and condemn), but God wants us to truly follow the law of conscience and law of love, which desires good upon everyone – even our enemies.

How can we do good to everyone or especially our enemies if we do not hope for or work for their eternal salvation and happiness? Shall we just let them burn in a fire for all eternity and give up on them? What the heck is that for evil thing or belief? Never! I will always fight for the so called damned and their salvation and work for them becoming good and being able to love again and being able to forgive and be forgiven. That is my faith, my belief, my position, which is why I am more worthy to be the ruler that decides in God's Heaven more than even God himself is, since I think and do more good than even God himself on this point. Even all secular laws would agree with me on this and deprive such an unworthy person as God is of his rulership, since God does evil on so many unfortunate souls by damning souls that all can love if they are only given the opportunity.

And before lying and saying to me that they (the so called damned) can't love because Christian teaching claims this, take a look in the world! You would lie if you say people, even those God damns, cannot love, for they certainly love other human beings while on earth. They might not love God (for various reasons, some for justified reasons like abhorring Hell and that their loved ones is or could be damned; some for not so justified reasons merely because they like doing evil etc.) and they might not be as good as he hypocritically desires them to be, but that is no excuse for damning them, since they are capable of loving and to give love and to receive love. Even if they would love no one in actuality, still, if one believes in hope and goodness, one can always work for and hope for their conversion and salvation, for when an eternity exist, something could always happen at some point to make a change of heart occur, so there is always hope! Yet God wants to damn people from being able to give love and receive love and he chooses to deny love and even to extinguish love in the damned! and for all eternity too!? How evil are you God for this thought if this is really true! And the same goes for all those who evilly and obstinately defend such an evil position. If you do, perhaps you should look a child in the eyes and remember that there are actually children burning in Hell right now WITHOUT the hope of ever feeling love, happiness or friendship again for all eternity according to some of the Saints' testimonies. Let us all hope that these evil testimonies are untrue, and that this child is truly forgiven and currently living in true happiness, true love and true friendship as all are meant to be.)

Saints and Christians throughout the ages did not even attack God for what He did on this point, since they did not think of it like we do. They only believed it was happening to people, souls and the fallen angels and that nothing could be done about it. They did not see God as the responsible part or that He could prevent it, rather, they saw it as something that cannot be prevented and that they, too, must avoid it. However, I am not looking at it like this since I have more understanding and know more, which is why I am approaching it in a different way. In other words, many of them were ignorant as to the truth of this point due to not having been indoctrinated correctly. Even so, they desired this unhappiness of Hell and damnation on no one, and they also desired that all should be saved. Saint Gemma Galgani, whom I love dearly, is a great example of this. Vatican II also has started to walk more and more towards this point of doctrine. Do you know why? That is because they follow their conscience, since one cannot will or desire a Hell upon anyone if one is, or will become, a good person according to the true law of love, justice and conscience, and that is because there are demonstrable better and truer solutions to this problem of not living up to God's hypocritical standard rather than an eternal, unjust Hell.

When one has become enlightened about the true law of justice, conscience, brotherhood, love and forgiveness just like the Vatican II has (they teach Universal Salvation and desires goodness upon everyone one, and many even teach that no one at all is damned and that Hell is empty! I truly and really love that doctrine with all my heart!), then one no longer so easily embraces positions like Hell and eternal damnation anymore, but rather strives to move away from repressive and inhuman doctrines such as this. And that is exactly what the enlightenment and revolution of the Second Vatican Council was all about.

The true law of love, justice and conscience is the test God made to see who will succeed on this point of being truly just even above a God himself, and that for a reason, since if God is not truly just, how will his Heaven be able to remain or an eternity of love, happiness and justice continue? Know this also, but since God can only understand everything inside of Himself or inside of his foreknowledge, if God is honest, He would have to admit there may be more things in existence than even He is aware of, and that there may be more God's above Him even more powerful then He is that he is unaware of since there might exists some things outside of Himself or outside of his foreknowledge that He is unaware of.

To give an example, even if a computer knows everything and can think about everything, it actually only knows what it has learned or understood so far. It does not yet know for a fact the future or what exactly it will become or who will exist, since this has not yet happened. The same with God. God might think He knows everything, and perhaps He do, but still, it may also be true that He don't and that there may be some things in existence outside of His understanding. In my belief, God could very well admit to this theory if He was asked about it, i.e., that there is a possibility that His understanding of things could work in this way, since the theory cannot be disproven. What then if God would be unjust, and everyone in Heaven desires damnation upon souls that can love and give love? Would such a empire remain or be able to defeat their enemies, or other God's or other great and mighty spirits or souls (if there exists such a thing somewhere unknown to God) if they in Heaven were ever attacked for their injustices (as they should be, in order to be deposed so that justice truly reigns in Heaven and on Earth)?

If those attacking were more just than God's Heaven, then no, God will fall, and so would his Heaven, but that for a reason, since it was unjust. Do you see now why true justice is important, and why one must dare to fight for true justice, even if a God Himself (just like a Hitler) condemned you for it? When there is true justice in Heaven and everyone desires good, even saving all souls and even desiring to save other souls in other places if there are other God's somewhere else that also damns souls, then such a Heaven and empire that acts good like this will strive and succeed and be successful and become a conqueror of them all, since they follow true justice and love. Such a Heaven would not have to fear anything except for becoming unjust, because if unjust gods or spirits could prevail over true justice and just God's, Souls, Spirits or Angels, what then will become of eternity? That is why I don't believe such a thing can happen, and why there is an infinite and unconquerable power in willing to be just and actually being just and in wanting to do good, since no one can resist such goodness with evil. And that is also why God so much loves justice and always (as He in fact say) follow it. Let us then hope God/Jesus/The Holy Spirit do follow true justice, and that damnation was only a test to see who wanted to be truly just and not only their childish slave.

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Introibo wrote: “so we don't need baptism by water or baptism by desire/blood. You don't even need to believe in Christ. … Why go to Church at all! When St. Paul tells us to “work out thy salvation in fear and trembling” he was out of his mind! … Everything you wrote in this post is a waste.” [I.e., Introibo's point against me is that you need to do or have some of these things in order to be saved and live in eternal love and happiness in Heaven, as opposed to eternal hate, darkness and torments in a sea of fire (and all other kinds of insufferable torments) in a Hell; torments more severe then even all the torments on earth combined! (According to many Saints, this is the truth of Hell.) Yes I know, his position is stupid, unmerciful and evil.]

Jerome responds: Correct, eternal salvation and happiness and love must not depend on such unimportant things as Baptism or believing in Christ or going to Church just in the same way as human justice and being treated humanly must not be dependent upon us being white or black, gay or straight (since gays are gays and probably will remain so whether you or God wants them to be so or not, it is wiser and much better to respect them and give them love and love them, for then all would be well, for there is true love even in homosexuality if one only truly loves, as is obvious), and if you are honest, you will admit that it is unimportant if one does this or that provided one believes in and follows love and justice even if a God whom you fear tells you otherwise.

But if you don't dare to be truly just, then you will fall, and even say evil things like that such people (who were merely unbaptized or died gay) must be damned and live in eternal unhappiness even if they can love and give love and hence deserves Heaven, as I am sure even you know is true, unless you are a liar, and perhaps you might even know some gay people or unbaptized who where really good people. Don't be a fool, don't be evil, don't break your conscience, for indeed, you would not follow your conscience if you believe souls should or must be damned only because a God said so!

After talking with me, I have a hard time to see how you could avoid breaking your conscience on this point since I have made this so clear to you that the law of love and doing good towards everyone is a true and just law that stands above even God's own laws; in addition to the fact that there might perhaps exist even greater and stronger Gods than the so-called Catholic God himself who wants us to believe in and follow this doctrine of justice, love and conscience and not deny it (as many sadly do by wanting or being silent about their fellow human beings being damned, which is also why they have failed in this respect to even higher things that still are to be known to us in the afterlife).

You see, there might be a perfectly just reason for why Pope Francis proclaimed he did not believe in the so-called Catholic God that could relate to this (of there actually being other and more mightier, truer and juster Gods)! Truly, if this our Catholic God desires damnation, then I too do not believe in Him as my true God as Pope Francis said. Perhaps the Eternal Father is the true God? Or the true Catholic God that is truly universal, has not made himself known yet? Perhaps there is a greater reason behind this than what we know for why God is named by many different names? That is something worth thinking about.

I will say it again, since this is true: since God can only know everything as a fact that He does already know about, or that is within Himself and His foreknowledge, He cannot actually claim to know everything absolutely (with infallibility), since not everything might exist or be present or known in His own person or knowledge. And I suppose even you see the true reason behind this argument (that we can only know and understand for certain what we already know about and not what we do not yet know anything about). Therefore, I believe God would admit if questioned in this way that there could exists more outside of Himself and that there might even be more Gods more powerful then Him and also that there might be more truths to the law of conscience according to other just beings or humans that other Gods or justices wants us to follow.

And also consider this, if you or I wanted more good then God himself and our conscience was more noble and more good and more beautiful than God's on some points, then why should not our position be followed on those points that we are more right on? It would be illogical and make no sense to not follow something better and more just only because a God dictator wants something else! That is why true justice must be followed and obeyed and why even a God himself must not be allowed to stand in the way, because otherwise will true justice not be followed. Yes, even a God himself must be resisted if He does evil or desires evil, and that is what we do, and what Vatican II is moving towards and achieving in peoples' faith.

If justice should be about obedience to someone rather than about true justice and goodness, then (to give an example) should God be allowed to become evil and crazy in his Heaven (if this could happen) and be like a dictator that hurts his elect children and does much evil to everyone just because He is God and He wills it or because he went crazy? Of course not. Again, should we just be like God's slaves and allow Him to do anything, even pure evil and pure injustice against the elect in Heaven or somewhere else only because He wills it and because “God is always right” when this fact is obviously not true or just? Of course not! That is not how true justice works, since true justice always follow justice and goodness regardless of who the ruler is, whether sane or crazy. Therefore, if the ruler is evil and unjust, and even if this ruler is God himself, then one must fight against him and depose him and deprive him of his power; and then, after this, can be thought about how one could achieve his betterment, healing, and conversion; so that he may love and become just again. This is justice, true justice. Anything else is not justice, but injustice that respects persons like a Hitler rather than following justice, like the just law.

One must never damn or cast away anyone as if they are worthless and without hope, and must one never loose hope oneself for their conversion towards love and goodness again if it ever happened that anyone became evil, but we must always have hope in goodness and that there can be love and conversion again, for when there exist an eternity, one must always have hope, for without hope, even in Heaven, a just and happy eternity cannot continue. Ask yourself this, how can an eternity continue in justice and goodness if we do not always hope in goodness without wavering? How can we always keep and have hope in and believe that bad people will and can become good again if we stopped believing in this? When there is hope, there is always work, and so long as one works on bad peoples conversion, there is always hope and a possibility that it might succeed and that they may have a change of heart, and that sooner than later (that is the power of faith and hope). That is why damnation is evil, since it deprives us of hope and denies the damned hope and why God also did wrong to have lost hope in the damned peoples conversion and betterment. Truly, If God gives me His place in Heaven in order to rule and decide such deep questions of salvation and conversion (which He should, if not to me, to someone else) then I will never loose hope, but I will always think of new ways to become friends with everyone and they with us, so that we all may love one another like a large eternal family as we were all meant to do.

When we die and finally meet each other, will will understand all of life's mysteries for sure in a better way.

Introibo wrote: “You don't need to live a good life...”

Jerome responds: And what the Hell has living a good life or not living a good life with being worthy, or not worthy, of eternal salvation or damnation? Since eternal damnation is evil and unjust, it must never be accepted or approved of, even if someone did not live a good life! If you truly love your neighbour, this is the only true and right position to hold, since otherwise, most of humanity will not make it into Heaven, and thus they will have a miserable existence for all eternity in torments, unlove and despair – if now God's evil Hell is true (which I am sure it is not).

But the arguments you make are stupid, really, because most humans do live good lives – even those who do not believe in God. So your arguments are pointless. Humans live good lives because goodness and love is a truth written in our hearts, and when one does good, one follows the law of conscience and that makes us happy. That is why it feels good to do good and it make others happy, such as aiding poor people and people in need, and why one feels miserable and sad if one neglects to do this. Hence most people follow the law of conscience on many points, some less, some more. That is how it always have been, but almost all follow it on the point of doing good, so most people are in fact good, even if many also do some mistakes or “sin” (some greater, some smaller), since we all do bad things from time to time.

But even if someone would have fallen into complete evil, that still does not excuse his eternal damnation, since everyone can become good and start to love again and become innocent like a child! That is the power of love, kindness, forgiveness and hope. If God has lost hope over the damned, then why should I? I will never loose hope in the faith I have that even Satan himself and all the damned can become converted from evil and be good and love again. That is my faith, that is my hope, that is my goal – and this, again, is another reason why I and everyone else who thinks like me are more fit to govern and rule in God's Heaven more than even God himself is, since God gave up hope for the damned and instead wished their eternal damnation, torment and unforgiveness without any hope of ever changing His will, whereas I would never do this (so help me God and Mary).

Since you are a lawyer if you were truly just in every court of law you would have to defend me and accuse God for all the points and accusations already mentioned, and if you were a judge, you would have to give me the victory and even call me good and noble, but God you would condemn as evil and as unmerciful and as a terrorist and a murderer and either send him to jail, or execution, or both for his crimes. That's how it works in the world, and as on Earth, so also in Heaven (Matthew 6:10). On earth, there is forgiveness, and there shall always be forgiveness both in Heaven and Earth; even for God himself and everyone else, even the damned. That is my faith, which is a true faith, since it follows true justice of doing good, and not the false justice of being a dictator with personal demands.

Introibo wrote: “The problem with those who reject Hell is that they believe themselves to be more merciful than God.”

Jerome responds: If you can't see or won't admit that our position and belief (all those who hate and reject Hell) is more merciful and better than God's since God actually desires an eternal Hell even for children whereas I (and those who think like me) do not, then you are a liar and must be evil – evil, because you approve of evil and think evil is “just” for the tragically damned ones, who are our neighbors, brothers, fathers, sisters, mothers, children and spouses!

So who is more merciful (answer honestly now so that the whole world will see your response and if you truly dare to be honest for once): Is God more merciful who wills damnation for the damned (such as 5 year old children) because of a false and excessive justice or am I more merciful who wills and desires their salvation and forgiveness with my whole heart and even fight for it to the condemnation of God and even to the risk of my own damnation or condemnation by this dictator God whom I will later face at the judgment when I have died (but whom I believe will not be able to withstand my good thoughts and justice)?

So what is your answer? Be absolutely honest now according to true justice (and not false justice which respects persons). I and the whole world and everything else, God included (which all are our witnesses) will await your response.

So God actually wills damnation of men, women and children if they merely died in his displeasure even if they displeased no one else! and he is merciful? and we shall just accept what he does and call him merciful on top of this? What an injustice! Truly, what an idiotic argument devoid of all logic, reason and justice! “God is good because he claims so, even if he allows to be damned almost everyone we know to torments and hellfire too horrible to even imagine!” And I am not surprised you have fallen into this idiotic reasoning. That, again, has happened since you do not dare to stand up to, and listen to, your own conscience and following it, a conscience which tells you that there is a justice and a truth even above a God himself if this God is not truly just (a justice that demands total obedience over everyone and everything)... So the argument that “God simply said so and therefore we must believe and follow his orders no matter what,” is not enough and no excuse, since there is no actual justice in such a position, and it is merely nothing different from what Hitler or his evil or deceived soldiers did who murdered innocent people by their own will or by following orders (and many of these soldiers later admitted to having had bad consciences, and also that they knew they did wrong – even if they followed orders). So can you see now how actually believing in a God with the faith that he must always be obeyed, can in fact lead people to break their conscience and do an injustice instead? I can see it clearly, since it has happened to you, which is why you have made evil comments before such as: it would be unjust to the elect if the damned were saved, and God would be unjust, if he forgave and saved a damned soul that deserves damnation and not salvation like the elect... So God would be unjust and the elect would take offense if he saved and forgave a 5 year old child that was already damned? Who could ever believe in such an evil thing? Can't you see how stupid and evil your position is? Yet this is your evil position, if you now truly still believe in and adhere to this evil “logic” or “reason” of eternal damnation. That is also why people who have merely accepted damnation of their loved ones just because God said so, also did wrong. Do you know why? That is because one must not accept an evil or approve of an evil or neglect justice, just because someone you respect or believe you must follow who is your God, said so.

If you are honest, as you should be, since you are a lawyer, you would agree with this. But if you are not honest, you will continue to ignore this and everything else I have written. Don't do this, but please, answer my questions honestly, and do not ignore them.

Introibo wrote: “It's [my position] pure emotion devoid of reason.”

Jerome responds: You should be ashamed of yourself! After all this information that has been written one more time just for you (and you have read my posts and comments before with similar arguments), then, if you still think all of these beliefs and positions that I and others advocate and hold is “only emotion” and also “illogical”, then you are not only a lair, but also evil. Do you know why? That is because the truth of love and of doing good towards everyone is an absolute truth that cannot be denied by anyone. It is a true justice which is an ultimate and certain justice that even God declares in his Bible is a “Golden Law”, i.e., the law of doing good to everyone just as we ourselves would wish to be treated good by others, including our enemies.

Salvation and eternal happiness for everyone, for our beloved brothers and sisters, neighbours and friends, mothers and fathers and children etc., is thus not only a fleeting emotion or unreasonable, but is rather a true love, a true feeling, and a true justice and is something infinitely beautiful and lovable that should make everyone happy. The fact that the avocation and fighting for everyone's salvation as I do does not make you happy but rather provokes you to condemn me as a heretic or deceived, is troublesome and sad, but I understand you, for I have been the same and condemned others, but when I got more knowledge of that this was wrong and why, I changed. Will you dare to do the same thing and change? In truth, if you won't change or persists in the same ways as before: What a complete and utter failure of an advocate you are, who do not even defend humanity one bit from eternal injustices in the afterlife (which is your obligation to do), nor do you accuse the God who must be accused by just people since he allows them all to be murdered in an eternal Hell for all eternity, which is the greatest injustice and evil that has ever been created and put into motion by anyone, at anytime!

To call the thought of everyone's salvation “devoid of reason”, as you do, is evil and totally stupid, brainwashed as you are. I hope you see this now and stop shaming yourself further.

Introibo wrote: ““I wouldn't want someone to torture me [or my wife, mother, father, etc] forever, so I could do things better than God. Hell does not exist.” See my post on the subject of Hell I wrote about 2 weeks ago: http://introiboadaltaredei2.blogspot.com/2019/08/Hell-under-fire.html”

Jerome responds: You are not only stupid, but also illogical, because you certainly don't want your wife, mother, father or children etc. to be tormented in a Hell (as you say), yet you would just silently accept the will of this so called God who would allow them to be tormented in a Hell for all eternity, without even trying to hinder it, if they now happened to be damned? That position, of course, is stupid... When a person has become so stupid and blind as you (and the fact that you are a lawyer and claims to follow justice has only made you more unreasonable) then it is hard to get anywhere logically and honestly in a discussion since both logic, reason and justice (which is part of honesty) is thrown out the window, just as we can see have happened with you

But why don't you address my actual points instead – centering on the meaning of true justice and what it is – instead of just posting the same garbage about Hell etc., that it simply just “must happen” because an evil dictator God (like Hitler) and blind Saints said so?

If your own child was burning in Hell now, I assume you would not be so senseless as to claim that this was just, or that you desired this to happen to him or her just because God wants it or because the Saints said so. Then perhaps you would change your view. Right? If not, then you actually say to your own child the equivalent of this: if you are damned, even if I love you and you did not offend me in life, I will still want your damnation, because my God whom I serve, wills it. can't you see how stupid this is? So someone you love and that did not offend you must be damned, only because someone else wants this? How is there justice with such a position, and especially so, if the so called damnable offense was not even a crime according to any law but for God's selfish will?

Indeed, to argue like this would be the equivalent to argue that murder of innocent people is justified just because some evil dictator president or king wanted it so and because his evil and brainwashed subordinates said so! So what does your post really prove? It proves nothing, except for the same garbage of “we just must believe in an eternal Hell and that it is true and that it happens in this way for our dear children and mothers and fathers and spouses because God has said so and wills it so”, not because it is just, but again, because God wills it so! coupled with the same idiotic arguments as for why an eternal Hell would be “just” or “logical” according to believers (but which it can never be however much they try to shamefully defend Hell). And since you think you must defend God rather than thinking for yourself or according to true justice, you tragically make the choice (against all justice) to instead defend this evil Hell and eternal damnation that happens to other people (people that all can love, give love and receive love but who are to be denied this for all eternity in hell, according to God's evil will and Hell and ETERNAL damnation).

I have already addressed all the points you bring up over and over, not only in this article, but also in the others. Try to reply to them instead instead of just hiding behind the same old arguments “that God said so” etc. because there is no true justice in this argument, and it also does not address the actual points of justice and what true justice is even if God damns you for it and what forgiveness and love is and what this truly means if one believes in eternal damnation as opposed to fighting for eternal salvation; and about having hope and to be willing to do more good then even God himself does when it comes to forgiveness and salvation, and if needed, even oppose God if that be needed, in order to think of something better. These are the points I would like to discuss with you, but so far, you have not made any response to my arguments or questions.

If you are only going to reply with that Hell is just or that God said so or God cannot be wrong etc. then this discussion with you is pointless, and won't go anywhere, and that is why I am asking you to actually adress my questions and arguments, since it is therein that the true justice and injustice of God and Hell and its morality will be shown.

And this is what I have done with my actions and replies, been moral and just. But Introibo, what have you done with yours in these posts, except for damning most of humanity and then even shamefully defending it? Is that something to be proud of? Can't you see how stupid all of this is? Please, don't choose to be stupid anymore, but rather open your eyes towards true justice which we are all meant to follow, even if a so called dictator God condemns you for it. Do you are to make this move? I certainly have!